sansaistark:berryevilpoptart:Terribleness of The White Princess — and ANY Philippa Gregory boo

sansaistark:berryevilpoptart:Terribleness of The White Princess — and ANY Philippa Gregory book — aside … Confessions like this make me laugh ‘cause how do ANY of us actually know how affectionate of a marriage Henry and Elizabeth actually had?  It’s all theory folks, since neither of them left a diary around describing their feelings — good, bad, or indifferent — for one and other.  Yes, Henry never  —- to any credible historical source — had a mistress. Nor did he remarry after Elizabeth died, but that’s hardly evidence of an affectionate marriage.It just makes me laugh how passionately folks feel about something as abstract and not provable — either way — as this.  Same goes for Henry VIII and his feelings about his wives.  Personally, I doubt any of them were capable of love in the way we think of it in our modern era … but that’s a whole other issue right there.My point being, who cares how one FICTION author interprets their marriage!  ‘cause there’s books out there going both ways on the subject.  Just pick the ones that sway your way and leave others to pick ones that sway there way and then at the end of it all, read some credible non fiction on these folks. Where exactly did you get the idea that we have no idea as to what Henry and Elizabeth’s marriage was like? Because there’s more than enough contemporary evidence to suggest that their marriage was happy, affectionate, and loving. I’ll begin with the little things first. Henry’s gifts to his wife were frequent; one of these gifts was a lion.We know of a few instances where Henry gave way to Elizabeth’s wishes ― he postponed the wedding of his daughter Margaret to the King of Scotland because she and his mother wished him to, as she was so young. He also wrote to the Pope declining his offer of four of his men becoming bishops, as his wife had already chosen her chaplain for the position. He let Elizabeth share a letter from their son Arthur and his wife Catherine of Aragon. This proves that Henry listened to her opinion and cared for her happiness. But perhaps one of the largest pieces of evidence for this argument was what occurred after Henry learned of the death of Prince Arthur:“When his Grace understood that sorrowful heavy tidings, he sent for the Queen, saying that he and his Queen would take the painful sorrows together. After that she was come and saw the King her lord, and that natural and painful sorrow, as I have heard say, she, with full great and constant comfortable words besought his Grace that he would first after God remember the weal of his own noble person, the comfort of his realm, and of her. She then said, that my lady, his mother, had never no more children but him only, and that God by his grace had ever preserved him, and brought him where that he was. Over that, how that God had left him yet a fair prince, two fair princesses; and that God is where he was, and we are both young enough ; and that the prudence and wisdom of his Grace sprung over all Christendom, so that it should please him to take this according thereunto. Then the King thanked her of her good comfort. After that she was departed and come to her own chamber, natural and motherly remembrance of that great loss smote her so sorrowful to the heart, that those that were about her were fain to send for the King to comfort her. Then his Grace, of true, gentle, and faithful love, in good haste came and relieved her, and showed her how wise counsel she had given him before; and he, for his part, would thank God for his son, and would she should do in like wise.”Hardly something that would pass between two people who weren’t fond of each other, is it?Upon her death at the age of thirty-seven, Henry “privily departed to a solitary place to pass his sorrows and would no man should resort to him”. He became a sullen and withdrawn man then, and greatly mourned her. He ordered one-hundred candles to be lit on the anniversary of her death each year. As one contemporary commented, her departing “was as heavy and dolorous as to the King’s Highness as hath been seen or heard of.” He ordered clothes in blue and black and even had his books bounded with blue velvet. In addition, here is a poem Elizabeth of York wrote after her marriage to Henry:“MY heart is set upon a lusty pin ;I pray to Venus of good continuance,For I rejoice the case that I am in,Deliver’d from sorrow, annex’d to pleasance,Of all comfort having abundance ;This joy and I, I trust, shall never twinMy heart is set upon a lusty pin.I pray to Venus of good continuanceSince she hath set me in the way of ease ;My hearty service with my attendanceSo to continue it ever I may please ;Thus voiding from all pensful disease,Now stand I whole far from all grievance-I pray to Venus of good continuance.”So, though Elizabeth and Henry never “left a diary around describing their feelings,” the evidence that their marriage was happy and affectionate from both sides is overwhelming, while there is no evidence to suggest that Henry was a man who abused his wife, both physically and verbally, as presented in The White Princess, nor is there any evidence that Elizabeth was deeply in love with her uncle Richard III.Perhaps if Philippa Gregory would admit what she writes is mostly fiction then she wouldn’t take as much heat as she does ― but she is under the impression that her books are very accurate and her portrayal of Henry is, in her own words, “probably right,” and many, many of her readers buy into it. Because of this, I think fans of Elizabeth and Henry’s relationship have every right to be upset.Also, though many marriages in historical England weren’t love matches, I think it’s rather absurd to suggest people who lived then weren’t able to love as people do today. In fact, there were quite a few instances of people marrying for love. I suggest reading about Edward the Black Prince and his wife Joan of Kent for just one example.  -- source link
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