eldritchgentleman: swindle94:eric-coldfire:brosefvondudehomie:syissuffering:dalek-ix-says-st

eldritchgentleman: swindle94: eric-coldfire: brosefvondudehomie: syissuffering: dalek-ix-says-stuff: durkin64: siryouarebeingmocked: tikkunolamorgtfo: fieldbears: fullmetalquest: robotsandfrippary: 99laundry: gogomrbrown: I learned in a Latin Studies class (with a chill white dude professor) that when the Europeans first saw Aztec cities they were stunned by the grid. The Aztecs had city planning and that there was no rational lay out to European cities at the time. No organization. When the Spanish first arrived in Tenochtitlan (now downtown mexico city) they thought they were dreaming. They had arrived from incredibly unsanitary medieval Europe to a city five times the size of that century’s london with a working sewage system, artificial “floating gardens” (chinampas), a grid system, and aqueducts providing fresh water. Which wasn’t even for drinking! Water from the aqueducts was used for washing and bathing- they preferred using nearby mountain springs for drinking. Hygiene was a huge part if their culture, most people bathed twice a day while the king bathed at least four times a day. Located on an island in the middle of a lake, they used advanced causeways to allow access to the mainland that could be cut off to let canoes through or to defend the city. The Spanish saw their buildings and towers and thought they were rising out of the water. The city was one of the most advanced societies at the time. Anyone who thinks that Native Americans were the savages instead of the filthy, disease ridden colonizers who appeared on their land is a damn fool. They’ve also recently discovered a lost Native American city in Kansas called Etzanoa It rivals the size of Cahokia, which was very large as well. Makes me happy to see people learn about the culture of my country :D Also, please remember that the idea of a nomadic or semi-nomadic culture being “less intelligent”, “less civilized” (and please unpack that word) was invented by people who wanted to make a graph where they were on the top. Societies that functioned without 1) staying exclusively in one location or 2) having to make complicated, difficult-to-construct tools to go about their daily lives… were not somehow less valid than others. This is why I fucking hate it when Europeans make jokes about how they have “more history” than the Americas. “This church is older than your country hahaha.” Actually, it’s older than the country you put there, massacring millions in the process, but go off, I guess.  I feel the need to point out that Native Americans warred with each other all the time, and Aztecs were particularly infamous for conquering tribes just for use as human sacrifices. I’d call that ‘savage’, regardless of skin color. Though last time I checked, the term ‘savages’ hasn’t been in common use in the West to refer to Indigenous people for longer than I’ve been alive. Cyn is complaining about racism that stopped long before she could ever experience it.  Mesoamerican pyramids and other native dwellings are actually very well known. I don’t know of anyone who thinks natives were ‘running around lost’. We also know about the Calendars. There was literally a big budget blockbuster based on them. It’s still a meme. I’m also fairly certain most Natives in North America died from disease, not conquest or murder. And if Tikk is referring to Cortes and the Spanish conquest, they had help from other Native tribes who didn’t like the Aztecs either. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_conquest_of_the_Aztec_Empire Oh, and OP was one of the alleged Russian chaos tumblrs. These fuckers seriously pretending that like a few decades during the dark ages is the template for all of European civilization, AGAIN? European nations had city planning in the BC time period. Nobody was actually impressed with your circular mud huts. As someone who had to learn this in history class (being mexican), I’d like to chip in my $0.4MXN.First, the Aztecs (or, more specifically, the Mexica, and yes that’s where “Mexico” comes from) were absolute bastards. They were descended from a group of mercenaries who were exiled for skinning the daughter of their patron alive, which was such a “Why the fuck did you do that moment” that their own creation myth (which was passed on to modern Mexico) basically pretended that part didn’t happen. And for all that Mexico-Tenochtitlan was a truly impressive city (the Spaniards comparing it favorably with Venice, for example), it was built almost literally on the corpses of their enemies. (As a sidenote, “Aztec” is a name coined much after by Humboldt and refers to the people of the Valley of Mexico as a whole, and what most people call the  “Aztec Empire” was actually the aliance between three city-states:  Mexico-Tenochtitlan, Texcoco and Tlacopan.) The list of shit the Mexica did is very long indeed, but I’ll try to list out the important points. First, human sacrifice. The image of people sacrificed on top of a pyramid (which was the sacrifice to Huitzilopochtli, the Sun/War God) was indeed a thing, and practiced multiple times a day over various temples across the Aztec empire. But what has to be mentioned is that the Mexica had several more gods, and a few of them also required human sacrifice. To name three: Tezcatlipoca’s sacrifices were required to be killed in gladiatorial combat, where the victim would be tethered in place, given a mock weapon, and then trained, armored and armed warriors would slaughter him. Huehueteotl’s sacrifices involved a large feast. At the end, captives would be burned alive, and then have their hearts cut out before they perished. Tlaloc’s sacrifices were children bought from their mothers. In the months leading up to the rainy season, they’d slay a group each month, and continue until the rains began. Since Tlaloc specifically required their tears, the victims were beaten, had their mouths and noses blocked by rubber,and thrown into a pool to drown. Again, children. Needless to say, this was all kinds of fucked up. And the Mexica practiced this fuckery on a scale that makes me shudder at the thought. Their need for sacrifices was such that they conducted what they call “Flower Wars”, which is the second item on this list. What were “Flower wars”, you might ask? Flower wars were wars waged not for territory, resources, or more conventional reasons, but to capture people to sacrifice to their gods. For the Mexica, “There’s a famine, so we need more sacrifices” was a perfectly acceptable and commonly used casus belli, and their warriors were encouraged not to kill their enemies when possible, so they could be captured and slain at the altars. Indeed, their constant need for sacrifices went on to bite them in the ass; literally the only reason Cortez was able to win against the Triple Alliance was because everyone else was sick of their shit. Most of the troops who fought on the Spanish side during the conquista weren’t Spaniards, but native mesoamericans. And the final item on this list will be the fact that the Triple Alliance dealt in that universal human evil: slavery. It had more in common with Greek or Roman slavery than the chattel slavery that would come later, but a dog is a dog regardless of breed. The Flower Wars mentioned above would also produce slaves along with victims for the altar, and some specific sacrifices required that the victim be a slave as well, although at that point it’s just piling injury over insult over injury. So the next time some pendejo goes on to claim that the natives were innocent and pure and much more advanced than the dirty, filthy Europeans who crossed the atlantic, you’re free to show them this and laugh in their fucking face. A shiny city does not hide the blood that runs over over the stones. can you PLEASE fuck off??? look. half native here. we barely get anything on this godforsaken hellsite, just let us have the few bits and scraps that we do get without having to ruin it. god, this is enraging. @dalek-ix-says-stuff I think this was meant for you. It can’t be ment for my Potawatomi/Cherokee/Chippewa ass. “We barely get anything on this godforsaken hellsite.” I can’t imagine why, especially if all you do it push misinformation and revisionist history. I fully agree the Aztecs and other ancient civs that practiced Human sacrifice are utter bastards. Tho the disease thing is kinda half and half on on the Europeans. As in half on purpose half accidental. Half was on purpose by giving them blankets that were deliberately covered in sick germs. The accidental was just the fact that the Europeans were exposed and covered in sicknessess that they were now immune/built up a resistance too and the natives just HAPPENED to catch those germs and their immune systems were unprepared. The bottom line is, there is no group of humans that is innocent of atrocities. We are all descended from bastards. So why don’t we calm down, stop throwing shit at each other and try to build something better? -- source link

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