thefirstknife: fandom-geek: sovpologist:thefirstknife: fandom-geek: so uh, this week’s tracing the s
thefirstknife: fandom-geek: sovpologist:thefirstknife: fandom-geek: so uh, this week’s tracing the stars quest was. uh. interesting Want to address the tags too. These are the voice lines from Mara:I’m not sure why are we ascribing malice to what Mara has done. She stated that “some, like Uldren” needed help to form their existence in the Distributary. Emphasis on “some.” Meaning that he wasn’t the only one who was unable to do it himself. Naturally, she was compelled to help her brother. Unfortunately, by helping him, Uldren eventually spiraled out of control due to their bond. If anything, this proves that he was NOT manipulated by her, given how this isn’t the first time she mentions that he was doing things against her wishes and being reckless. In a way, by giving him this “star to follow,” she accidentally gave him too much of a drive to do whatever it takes, even if it’s against her wishes. If she were doing it maliciously, wouldn’t she have made him completely docile?Now, is the creation of the Awoken and their whole Distributary business filled with issues? Yes, of course. They were created through a clash of two paracausal forces. Doesn’t happen every day. It’s not like Mara counted on that and knew exactly what to do. She made mistakes. Her treatment of Uldren and the way she thought she was helping him that resulted in the exact opposite was one of those mistakes. That’s my take on the discourse. Mara made a mistake by trying to help her brother while they were passing through a black hole created by the battle between Light and Darkness. I struggle to see any tangible proof of Mara being malicious with what she has done (and if any such proof exists, would love to see it). If this isn’t meant to be interpreted as thinking that Mara was malicious about it, then I don’t really see the point. This is a slightly more detailed rehash of what we know from Marasenna. I guess if we want to fault Mara for something, it would be faulting her for not apologising for making that mistake, though this apology is not supposed to be aimed at us and the person it’s supposed to be aimed at is dead. it’s also worth mentioning that uldren hero-worshipped mara even before they became awoken. so it wasn’t like she was just doing this for shits and giggles bc it boosted her ego or something, she was trying to give uldren something familiar to hang onto as he struggled to grasp his new identity. did it work out? obviously not, and it hurt BOTH of them in the end, but mara couldn’t have foreseen that. my issue isn’t inherently with mara influencing uldren’s creation from uldwyn or even uldren/uldwyn’s relationship with mara, it’s specifically that she insults uldren (”pathetic recklessness”) for displaying a trait she encouragedespecially in a situation where we, as players, are aware that mara went into her plan knowing that savathun would kill uldren if oryx died Mara will begin the end of that Queen’s brother today. She knows what that means for the fate of her own. An eye for an eye. like if we had mara helping uldren into the distributary on its own, just without the line about “pathetic recklessness” - i’d be fine with that! but bungie specifically included that line to demonstrate mara’s feelings towards uldren, and that’s the bit i’m disturbed by. I don’t think she encouraged recklesness itself. Uldren was reckless even as a human: the first time we see him, he’s in a fight he knows he’ll lose:Uldwyn grins messily at Mara over his opponent’s shoulder. He’s fighting a big, brutal woman from Gravity Ops, a woman who’s had her myostatin genes knocked out so she can swell up into a giant plug of brawn. Uldwyn doesn’t have a chance. He took the fight for the same reason he wanted to join the Amrita expedition—he measures himself by the bravery of his losses. By what he can survive losing.Mara has nothing to do with his recklessness. In the same lore page, she expresses sympathy with his pain and brings him pictures so he can trade for the stuff he needs. Their unhealthy relationship was not created by Mara. It was created by their mother, Osana:“Mara, even when you were little, you wanted me to treat you like an adult. So I have. But you remember what I told you, don’t you? If you don’t want to be my daughter, I can’t watch over you like a mother would. I can’t put you first, like a mother would. I will always be your friend, but I have to make my own choices too.”What type of a crap parent does this when their little kid tells them “treat me like an adult”? Due to this relationship and Osana’s refusal to involve herself in raising her daughter, as well as subsequent overprotectiveness of Uldwyn, Mara essentially raised herself. Badly. Which is what happens when you have crap parents. On top of that, she was largely also responsible for raising her brother who began idolising her. Their mother washed her hands off them, unless she wanted to be overprotective of her son at random intervals and then completely dismissive at others:She looks to Osana. “What about your boy? He’s in medical more often than any of the other underground fighters.”It does not surprise Mara that Captain Li knows about the fights. “My son,” Osana says, “is determined to be his own worst enemy. Thank you for taking the time to speak to us.”That’s all you have to say, Osana?Mara was further influenced by Alice Li whom she idolised and she had no one to correct her behaviour (remember also that Mara was a teenager at this point: at only 19 years old, people do some stupid stuff). It didn’t help that Alice encouraged Mara to continue cultivating her personality worship, something Mara originally did not want to do at all. My point is that Uldren’s recklessness is not an invention of Mara. Her attempt to help him in crossing over may have worsened that aspect of him, but it’s not something Mara specifically wanted to worsen. She is expressing her frustration that Uldren went off the rails in that direction. She never liked it and it’s not something she specifically “programmed” into him. The fact that she’s angered that he was reckless suggests so. His recklessness as Uldwyn that I quoted at the start is directly also paralleled here, as Uldren, when he decides to fight Sjur for Mara:Mara pressed her hand to Sjur’s faceplate and left no stain. She held Sjur’s gauntlet to her heart so Sjur could feel her steady pulse and even breath. “You don’t care about him?” Sjur pressed her. “It would mean nothing if I maimed him?”“You ask the right questions,” Mara said, “but of the wrong sibling.”Then Sjur understood that she fought a man who would always express his love through loss and ordeal.Also, it’s heavily implied that the woman he wrestled as a human is the person that would later become Sjur as an Awoken. So this is kind of a rematch. Either way, Mara did not like him being reckless or taking unnecessary risks. She specifically warned him against it multiple times but every time she warned him, it’s as if it just made him want to do it even more. This culminated with Uldren going to the Black Garden against her orders. Mara’s remark about Uldren’s “pathetic recklessness” is not Mara saying that she made him reckless on purpose and is now mocking him for being as she made him. She is expressing frustration that this is how he’s always been and that even with her help, she couldn’t change that part of him (and also possibly unintentionally made it worse by trying to help). -- source link